To: devnull@falcon3.k9.com (Falcon3 Mailing list) From: devnull@falcon3.k9.com (Falcon3 Mailing list) Reply-To: devnull@falcon3.k9.com (Falcon3 Mailing list) Sender: devnull@falcon3.k9.com (Falcon3 Mailing list) Errors-To: postmaster@falcon3.k9.com Return-Path: devnull@falcon3.k9.com (Falcon3 Mailing list) Precedence: bulk Bcc: falcon3-outgoing Subject: Falcon3 Digest V6 : I38 Falcon3 Digest Volume 6 : Issue 38 Tue Jul 12 06:04:33 PDT 1994 Compilation copyright (C) 1994 Jeff Beadles Send submissions to "falcon3@falcon3.k9.com" Send add/drop requests to "majordomo@falcon3.k9.com" Archives are available via ftp from ftp.k9.com [199.2.109.18] Today's Topics: Re: More vertical landing speeds slb512@serveru1.naic.wpafb.af.mil ( Falcon3 & ihhd (fwd) Chera Bekker Re: Falcon3 and IHHD stenger@zeus.uni-duisburg.de (Joerg Falcon Gold. krismon@hh.sbay.org (Kris Ong) Re: Falcon Gold S_MORGAN@delphi.com WCS Mark II Revelation S_MORGAN@delphi.com ------------------------------------------------------------ From: slb512@serveru1.naic.wpafb.af.mil (stuart butts/taai/75033) Subject: Re: More vertical landing speeds > Date: Thu, 7 Jul 94 09:02:00 +0100 > From: J.Hoppenbrouwers@kub.nl (JeroenHoppenbrouwers) > To: falcon3@onion.k9.com > Subject: More vertical landing speeds > > I obviously flunked on terminology. I did not mean "What are typical > rates of descend", but "What are typical touch down vertical speeds". > What your variometer tells you just before the wheels touch the tarmac. I'm not sure about those, I never really checked. You only have a 2 deg cushion in AOA from the standard approach AOA (11 deg) to play with, so you don't really flare that much, plus the tail will strike if you get 15 deg of pitch attitude on the jet. > Small civilian aircraft can come in without engine, although the approach > would be rather steep to keep enough speed to flare for the last seconds. > Jets however seem to need a power approach all the time, given their > brick tendencies. Can you safely land a jet without the engine, or is > it strongly discouraged? Yes you can, and the single-engine jets (only the F-16 is left now though since the A-7 is no longer in the USAF) practice all the time. By practice I mean a pure idle power and speedbrakes out approach and landing. They don't actually kill the motor. This is quite an accurate approximation 'cause the motor puts out almost nothing at those low power settings. This is called an SFO (simulated flame-out) landing. As long as you can make it to the field, the F-16 is quite easy to put down in an SFO as long as the winds aren't real gusty. > Can someone (guess who) compile something like an approach checklist > for the F16, with typical altitudes, air speeds, pitch angles and > related AoAs etc. from the moment you are cleared to land until touchdown? Well, it's all based on AOA and where you want to set down. On speed is 13 deg AOA, however this is also the max for landing. So, most guys fly an 11 deg AOA approach and flare to 13 deg. For the F-16A, final approach speed for an 11 deg AOA approach is 125 knots +8 knots per 1000 lbs of fuel/stores. If you fly a non-flaring 13 deg AOA approach its 125 knots +4 knots per 1000 lbs. SOP is to put the jet on the ground with a minimum of 1000 lbs. If you do the standard overhead type landing pattern, you come onto initial at 300 knots, 1500 ft AGL. Do a 3-4g break at the numbers and bring the power back. Drop the gear as you roll out onto downwind looking for about 180 knots about 1-2 mile lateral seperation from the rwy. Roll into the base turn as the rwy reaches about 5 (or 7 depending on which way you break) o'clock. Get to on speed AOA and just pull it around looking for about 500-600 fpm descent. Put the flight path marker on the numbers and fly it in. I don't do this in F3 'cause I don't think its any fun in the sim. Maybe when we HMDs. I just do straight ins in sims. For the F/A-18, on speed is about 8 deg AOA which is 125 knots +2.5 knots per 1000 lbs of fuel/stores over the first 2000 lbs. For the carrier, they initial at 300 knots, 800 ft AGL. Do the break. Roll out on downwind at about 600 ft AGL, looking for on speed AOA with the gear down. Turn to base down through 450 ft. > Jeroen - Stuart ------------------------------- From: Chera Bekker Subject: Falcon3 & ihhd (fwd) Greg wrote: > > To be honest I don't think we ever got Ken's TSR and IHHD working. I seem > to remember that it requires a comm program to connect the 2 computers. This > is not really what IHHD does, since we don't connect the 2 machines directly. > And then, whatever we would have working got screwed with the NEW patch. > Since, as we all know, these aftermarket programs will only work on one > version. Just one more reason why I lost interest in the EBS... > True, Greg and I never did try with 3.04 and the COM TSR (only 3.02). However Joerg Stenger and I did get a working IHHD connection with 3.04 using the COM TSR. The connection time was much faster then the previous times with either Greg.or Joerg Chera H.G. Bekker bekker@tn.utwente.nl Voice: +3153893107 Applied Physics Fax: +3153354003 University of Twente PGP public key - finger: Si vis pacem The Netherlands bekker@slater.tn.utwente.nl Para Bellum ------------------------------- From: stenger@zeus.uni-duisburg.de (Joerg Stenger) Subject: Re: Falcon3 and IHHD In Issue 37/V6 Greg Cisko wrote: > To be honest I don't think we ever got Ken's TSR and IHHD working. I seem > to remember that it requires a comm program to connect the 2 computers. This > is not really what IHHD does, since we don't connect the 2 machines directly. > And then, whatever we would have working got screwed with the NEW patch. > Since, as we all know, these aftermarket programs will only work on one > version. Just one more reason why I lost interest in the EBS... Greg, at least during the h2h between Chera and me we both used Ken's TSR with great success. The connection time dropped from more than 20 minutes (2k4 connect) to 3 minutes. We used a comm-prg. to login on our accounts, met on IRC to brief eachother, fired up the dialer, left the comm-prg (Telix on my side) without hanging up, started falcon3 and choosed direct conection at the comms menu. I think that the tsr doesn't care if you have plugged in a modem or a null- modem, it just takes care of the *port* and from my understanding IHHD emulates a kind of Null-modem via internet lines. Am I wrong here? Joerg "Dancer" Stenger ------------------------------- From: krismon@hh.sbay.org (Kris Ong) Subject: Falcon Gold. It's awful quiet... I'm getting worried. ;) anyway.. does anyone have the F3 CD yet? how is it? what are the Drive requirements(access/transfer rate), etc. What are the changes in 3.05? blah blah blah. Kris. - -- krismon@hh.sbay.org The Electronic Battlefield Series FAQ Prodigy: GRTV13B http://www.hh.sbay.org/~krismon/public.html ftp://hh.sbay.org/users/krismon/ebsfaq ------------------------------- From: S_MORGAN@delphi.com Subject: Re: Falcon Gold Hi all, Kris asked about Falcon Gold. I was at home for a day or so and logged on to Prodigy for giggles and grins through parents account. Did not take serious notes, but there were a few comments about this new release there. Falcon Gold is a CD. HD space goes from 11 mb up to 23 (??) as I recall. The basic gist is you get F3/ ig/Hornet on one CD. As I hear it the Hornet is easier to fly. No super specifics, but the flight models have been tweaked. No. 19 said on CIS that the flight models have been modified "so they preform more like F3". This is cryptic to say the least. I think the consensus was that the handling of the aircraft is more like the F16 as far as ...well..intangibles. That is, they have different f;light models, but they have the easy feeling of F3. Hard to explain actaully, but use your imagination. Lord knows I have to to decipher this. There are no addons with the package and as I hear it, the addons we have come to know and love will not work with it, but I suppose they are in the works as we speak. I think the Art of the Kill stuff comes with Falcon Gold. All in all, it looks like this is all the F3 family in their latest incarnation with some nice extras. Special note: Someone said that the latest versions will not connect with FalconGold Comms, though no comments of better comms in Falcon Gold was mentioned. If you have a CD RO and a re a die hard F3'er, it sounds like a must have. One the other hand, I really like F3.01.1 with all my little addons. Soooooooo It isn't F4, just the next thing in line. This is all what I have heard. I do not have it. Corrections gratefully accepted. I wil peruse CI$ for details and reproduce here till someone (Jeff) tells me to knock it off. See yall, Scott in WV S_Morgan@Delphi.com (Now in Annapolis) Morgan@wvugeo.wvnet.edu (can telnet to for mail recovery) ------------------------------- From: S_MORGAN@delphi.com Subject: WCS Mark II Revelation Hi all, Not and advertisement for Tmaster, but I have to say I am impressed with my new Mark II and Falcon3!! My cat trashed my Mark I, so I have an excuse to jump for the Mark II. Once I got it, I set it up, and DL'd a standard F3 *.ADV file. MAN!! My FCS *Never* worked with Native Mig or Hornet or F304. Just my set up, but I never had success. Witht he MArk II, I was goofing around and see that by "double clicking my hat I can get left/right/back views in either up or down view. Also had quite a few additonal features my WCS Mark I did not have. Kinda like front speakers in your car, a second Turbo on your intake manifold, or a stainless steel exhaust system, it is one of those things you think you can do without until you have it. Disclaimer: I no work for Tmaster, just spent some bucks, it works, and felt like crowing a little. BTW, anyone know Auger from the AW mailing list? I met him at the Andrews Air Show. He showed me his system where he and a bud engineered a system where he can do next to everything from a joystick etc. He uses it extensively n F3 and AW. Needless to say, the SA such a system gives him is worth its weight in flaming metal. 300.00 I think he is selling it for. Too rich for my blood. Besides, I am too pale from online time as it is!@! Last thing I need is another reason to spend money and stay on line. Sorry for the diversion. Scott in WV S_Morgan@Delphi.com Morgan@wvugeo.wvnet.edu ------------------------------- [[ End of digest Volume 6 : Issue 38 ]]